From the Debate Files


More examples of Christian Bible rationalizations and preaching.

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TOPIC: Some parts of the Law of God are "finished" and have been done away with.

A very common claim among Christians is that the law of God can be selectively obeyed because parts of it were made obsolete by Jesus.
According to this popular Christian piece of advertising, most of God's laws are "finished" while a few others are still to be observed.
The following are some excerpts made by a Christian in a Bible forum regarding the law of God.

Christian:
…..the old ceremonial law has been done away with.
The reasons that God did this in the Old Testament was really the fault of his chosen people.

Commentary:
This is an utterly false statement if the Old Testament word of God is to be taken seriously.
All of the commandments of God are declared to stand forever and none have been "done away with".

Psa 111:7-8
The works of his hands are verity and judgment;
all his commandments are sure.
They stand fast for ever and ever, and are done in truth and uprightness.


Psa 119:152,160
Concerning thy testimonies, I have known of old that thou hast founded them for ever.
Thy word is true from the beginning: and every one of thy righteous judgments(statutes) endureth for ever.


The fact that the Israelites didn't always keep the laws does not mean God did away with some of them.
This would be like a town removing the traffic lights at intersections because some people ran red lights and broke the law.
Christians often advertise God as being the source of all moral absolutes, yet at the same time they claim that God did away with his laws.
The laws that Christians don't care to acknowledge as valid, they call "ceremonial" and dismiss.

The new covenant, which Christians are fond of proclaiming that they are living under, says absolutely nothing about some laws being canceled.

Jer 31:33
But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD,
I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

There is also no mention of faith in a human sacrifice replacing obedience to God's laws.

Christian:
Jesus said that He came to fulfill the law. When he hung on the cross he said "it is finished" the old law was done away with.

Commentary:
This is another conflicting claim and fanciful Christian speculation, this time about what Jesus meant when he said "it is finished".
Jesus did not say "the law is finished" and there is no reason to think that he meant anything other than the role he claimed God had for him as a sacrifice.
This claim that the "old law was done away with" is contradicted by Jesus himself.
Matt 5:17-20(Jesus speaking)
Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.


As Jesus clearly states, whoever breaks even the least commandment shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven and that people should have the righteousness of the Pharisees. The Pharisees were followers of the law.
Heaven and earth have not passed away, nor has everything been fulfilled.
In the Book of Revelation, it is clearly stated that some future events were yet to be fulfilled.
This would occur after Jesus had died on the cross.

Rev 17:17
For God hath put in their hearts to fulfil his will, and to agree, and give their kingdom unto the beast, until the words of God shall be fulfilled.


So obviously, everything hasn't been fulfilled yet, nor was everything fulfilled when Jesus died..

Christian:
Not that it(the law) was destroyed; but finished.

Commentary:
This is double speak.
In other words, according to this sophistry the law wasn't destroyed, it was just set aside like an old shoe.

Christian:
As far as the commandments; they will stand until heaven and earth pass away. The first three are how we should treat God and the last seven are how we should treat each other.

Commentary:
There is nothing in the Old Testament Bible that says the Ten Commandments would be continued while the other commandments will be "finished" and no longer need to be observed.

Deut 4:2,40
Ye shall not add unto the word which I command you,
neither shall ye diminish ought from it, that ye may keep the commandments of the LORD your God which I command you.
Thou shalt keep therefore his statutes, and his commandments, which I command thee this day, that it may go well with thee, and with thy children after thee, and that thou mayest prolong thy days upon the earth, which the LORD thy God giveth thee, for ever.


As already shown in the verses of Psa 111 and Psa 119, all of God's regulations are binding into the future, not just the Ten Commandments.

Christian:
The 10 commandments are not the ceremonial law. The ceremonial law is stated in Leviticus.
This is the law that has been done away with.

Commentary:
This is another false set of assertions if the Old Testament is to be taken seriously.
There were over 600 laws given in the Old Testament, and many of them are found in Leviticus.
According to this Christian, God tossed out the "ceremonial" laws in Leviticus and kept the Ten Commandments.
Among the laws in Leviticus are the following instructions:
Lev 19:37
Therefore shall ye
observe all my statutes, and all my judgments, and do them: I am the LORD.

Notice that God says…. "ye shall observe all my statutes, and do them".
Yet, this Christian declares that "this is the law that has been done away with".
So much for the moral absolutes of God, as they bite the dust in favor of Christian preferences and whims.

In the Messianic era which Christians claim Jesus ushered in, God promised that he would cause the people to obey all his statutes, not just the Ten Commandments.

Ezek 36:27
And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.


Ezek 37:24
And David my servant shall be king over them; and they all shall have one shepherd: they shall also walk in my judgments,
and observe my statutes, and do them.

There is no evidence that the Messianic era has even occurred. Not only do many Christians go around telling people that God canceled some of his laws, they don't observe the Sabbath properly, which is one of the Ten Commandments.

There is also nothing in the following scripture that states only some laws need to be obeyed and that other are "finished" and no longer binding.

Keeping the laws of God are defined as the essence of righteousness:

Psa 119:1-4
Blessed are the undefiled in the way,
who walk in the law of the LORD.
Blessed are they that keep his testimonies, and that seek him with the whole heart.
They also do no iniquity: they walk in his ways.
Thou hast commanded us to keep thy precepts diligently.

To repeat, there is absolutely nothing in any of these verses which says that parts of the law would be "finished".
The law is not a cafeteria line where you get to pick which ones you like.
Being one of God's people, as many Christians repeatedly claim they are, requires the hard work of actually following the laws he gave.

Christian:
"Also, a scriptural reference where Jesus says that the law is invalid."
Luke. 16:16
The law and the prophets where until John: since that time the kingdom of God is preached. and every man presseth into it."

Commentary:
If Jesus meant in Luke 16:16 that the law was invalid, then he contradicted his own claim in Matt 5:17-20, where he claimed that every law was to be obeyed with the detail and righteousness that the Pharisees practiced.
If Jesus was the valid messiah, then he was to usher in the era of great compliance with the law as the Old Testament verses Ezek 36:27 and Ezek 37:24 promise.
A valid messiah certainly wouldn't claim that parts of the law no longer needed to be observed.

As a final note, the Prophet Isaiah had something to say about those who attempt to dismiss the law.

Isa 8:20
To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because
there is no light in them.

According to Isaiah, Christians like this have no light in them.
Many Christians mock the very God they claim to worship, for they wish to "finish" the law and erect a human sacrifice icon as an excuse to ignore it.

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TOPIC: Yet another Christian claim that the law of God has been "overwritten" and done away with.

Many Christians simply don't recognize all of the Holy Bible as being valid.
Not only do they fail to recognize parts of the Bible as valid, they make claims that directly contradict the word of God. Since they deem much of the Old Testament unfit for their consumption, that section of the Holy Bible becomes an obsolete relic.

It's both interesting and revealing how the alleged word of God is relegated to obscurity when theological expediency and personal whim take over.
The same theme found in the earlier example about the law is also evident here.
Another typical demonstration of this rationalization phenomenon can be found in the following:

A skeptic asked:
Why do you claim his(God's) laws are overwritten?

Christian answers:
The "laws" represent the first covenant between man and God to stave off judgment.
The whole of the Old Testament is about how the covenant works and how, no matter how many reconciliations He offered them, the Jews couldn't stick to it. Particularly the part about not having any other gods before Him.

Commentary:
The covenant expressed through the laws are supposed to represent God's absolute moral standard for humans to live by.

Psa 19:7
The
law of the LORD is perfect, converting the soul: the testimony of the LORD is sure, making wise the simple.

Just because some of the laws were broken by the people doesn't mean that the law was done away with. How utterly bizarre, especially when it comes from a believer who advertises their God as the ultimate authority in the universe.
According to this rather absurd line of thinking, God did away with his laws and decided to overwrite them with a new system. The Bible debunks this cozy Christian notion by declaring God's laws to be forever and not done away with by the whims of men.

Psa 111:7-8
The works of his hands are verity and judgment; all his commandments are sure.
They stand fast
for ever and ever, and are done in truth and uprightness.

If Christians are the new chosen people and children of God, as they so often advertise to the world, then they should demonstrate their loyalty and eagerness to please God by doing what they claim the Israelites failed to do.

Here's what God wants his children to do:
Deut 4:2
Ye shall not add unto the word which I command you,
neither shall ye diminish ought from it, that ye may keep the commandments of the LORD your God which I command you.

Yet, in a glittering display of self serving disobedience, this Christian manages to cancel the law of God in favor of a new system, which they claim God decided to institute in place of his "old" system.

Christian:
The new covenant between man and God is found in the blood of Christ.

Commentary:
Nice rewrite of the new covenant.
Too bad it's not found in the Old Testament where God defines the new covenant.
This is pure unadulterated human rationalization at work.
The Bible once again exposes this Christian assertion as a fraud.
When the new covenant is initiated, each man will die for his own sin and God will put his law inside the people so that they will obey it.

There is absolutely no mention of a bloody human sacrifice being needed to atone for the sins of anyone, nor is there anything which states that God's law would be overwritten or replaced by a new system based on faith in a one size fits all human sacrifice.

The new covenant defined by God states that:
Jer 31:30-33
But
every one shall die for his own iniquity: every man that eateth the sour grape, his teeth shall be set on edge.
Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a
new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:
Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD:
But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD,
I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

Christian:
Since Christ has come to give us the good news of this covenant there is no other deal a man can make that will satisfy God's righteous judgment.

Commentary:
The bad news is that this Christian ignores what the Old Testament description of the new covenant actually says.
The Old Testament also makes it clear what would happen when the new covenant was put in place and a valid king Messiah ruled.

Ezek 37:24
And David my servant shall be king over them; and they all shall have one shepherd: they shall also walk in my judgments,
and observe my statutes, and do them.

A Messiah would usher in the era of a new covenant and the people would display a great compliance with the law.
The law would not be discarded or overwritten at all.

Naturally, verses like Jer 31:30-33 and Ezek 37:24 are ignored by most Christians, who like to follow the New Testament writer Paul instead of God.
It was Paul who declared, and contradicted the Old Testament in the process, that a Messiah would be the end of the law(Rom 10:4).

This is typical behavior that can be observed in the nature of the Christian religion, where a believer writes their own script while giving lip service and claiming to adhere to the Bible.
According to what the Old Testament text states, the laws will not be replaced by anything but will be reaffirmed under a new contract.
Yet, none of these details seem to bother believers like this, who then claim to unbelievers that there is "no other deal" a man can make that will satisfy God.
Believers such as this are actually inventing their own deal with God and then claiming that God agrees with them.

This type of advertising falls under the classification of pious fraud, being both self serving and boastful while cloaked behind a veil of deluded "righteousness".

Christian:
But the good really news is that its free and for all.

Commentary:
This is blatant false advertising based on misuse of the word "free".
The word "free" means without charge.
However, the cult of Jesus(aka Christianity) widely proclaims that failure to accept Jesus as your savior and turn your soul over to him will result in eternal damnation for anyone who fails to perform the proper work of belief.
This so-called free gift is actually an ultimatum.

Christian:
Your perfection is not required in order to be heaven bound.
Just your agreement to allow the perfection of Jesus stand in for you.

Commentary:
Once again this contradicts the word of God from the Old Testament.
Each person will die for his/her own sin and will redeem himself and save his soul by obeying the laws of God.
No human sacrifice savior is needed or required.

Ezek 18:20-21,27
The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.
But if the wicked will turn from all his sins that he hath committed, and
keep all my statutes, and do that which is lawful and right, he shall surely live, he shall not die.
Again, when the wicked man turneth away from his wickedness that he hath committed, and doeth that which is lawful and right, he shall
save his soul alive.

Christian:
In this way the laws were overwritten with originator of the law.

Commentary:
In this way, theological concoctions and spin are vomited forth by believers and then passed off as revelations based on the word of God.

The Old Testament warns God's true followers about dark people like this believer, who attempt to "overwrite" his law.

Isa 8:20
To
the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

As the prophet Isaiah warns, there is no light to be found in false believers like this.


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